Mystery flycatcher at Waxham

[forktail]

Hi there

yesterday afternoon a birding mate of mine called me about an interesting flycatcher he'd seen at Waxham. It showed a few pro Semi-collared features and he asked me to check it out. Knowing Dave well from numerous foreign trips as a very steady, patient and solid observer, I took it very seriously and myself and three other locals arrived on site shortly after and after a bit of bashing about located the bird. It showed three pale-tipped median coverts on the right wing and was quite a grey bird (obvious when against green foliage) with a large amount of white obvious in the tail when the bird flew. It was an interesting bird.

We watched the bird on and off for a while and news was eventually put out from Norwich I think (not from us) Many birders arived as the light was fading and most of the original observers had left. By this time I was happy with the views I'd had and wasn't paying much attention. Unfortunately it seems that a Pied Fly (there were two of these present as well last night) may well have been observed in the gloom rather than the grey bird with obvious median tips etc.

anyway, pics of the bird are here, well done to Dave, whatever transpires with the final identification. These birds are a minefield and amazingly difficult / impossible to pin down. I also hope people are at least a little grateful that news was released, in what is at the moment a sensitive area. As an aside what a wonderful time it was to be cycling around the village with redstarts and pied flys flitting from every tree it seemed. Magical.

constructive comments and humourous asides welcome.

F.

[Brian S]

Forktail

Just to add to the picture, I have spent all afternoon checking Pied Flycatchers around Southwold. Amongst the 29 I saw and watched well, several showed wing bars, but two had much more prominent white on the median coverts than the Waxham bird shows.

I heard Semi-collared calling in Bulgaria this year, and felt they were a bit more like Collared than Pied. I have no recordings, so can anybody that does check on this, please.

Brian S

[Russ Heselden]

The bird was there again this evening and hopefully a lot more photos have been taken. There were certainly some big lenses about. I watched it for about an hour and in that time saw only one other person with a notebook; given that some had apparently travelled quite a way to see the bird it was interesting that hardly anyone was studying it at all closely.

I noted all the features that Forktail mentions and it is certainly an interesting bird. The second bar on the right wing is quite strong at certain angles, as shown well in the photos. There were several other Piedys around though and after looking at 'the' bird I spent some time looking at these for comparison. One of these, not too far away, also showed a median covert wing bar (both wings) formed by off white tips to at least three feathers. As Brian S suggests this is possibly reasonably common, perhaps especially on first winter birds. 'The' bird certainly has a lot of white in the tail and a suggestion of a greyish nape, and also seemed noticeably paler than the others I looked at... but then that's quite a small sample. It doesn't 'flick' wings as much (just an observation, probably not at all significant - perhaps it's just knackered!). Shouldn't there be more of an extension of the paleness of the chin/throat/upper breast around towards the nape, giving a bit more of a hint of a half collar? And shouldn't it be noticeably greyer on the rump?

Thanks to the finders for flagging this bird up and posting comments. Even if it doesn't turn out to be a Semi-collared it's certainly going to make me look a lot more closely at any more Pieds I see this autumn.
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[Brian S]

White as base of primaries extends out onto p6 only.

Lots of reasons why it isn't one, but can anybody tell me why they think this is a Semi-collared?

Brian S

[Colin Key]

I wonder how many of you remember that series on BBC2 many years ago about "fanatics" - the first episode was entitled "Twitchers"?

Very good 50 minute programme, introduced by Lee Evans, and included a lot of people I knew at that time. The section on the Scilly Isles with the frenzied activity when someone had a "possible" Semi-collared was brilliant. I recall the footage of Lee cussing and swearing and actually "ordering" some menial to set up his 'scope (he was advertising for Optolyth at the time) and "get it onto the bird" for him!!! :ohdear:

I believe that the assembled masses (summoned by Dick Filby on his two-way radio) were actually blocking the road to someone's house and when the owner arrived by car he ran over Lee Evans' foot resulting in more expletives which were "buzzed out" by the Beeb :laugh:.

Great programme (I might go and dig it out and watch it again), both serious and light-hearted, and made us all realise what a load of prats we are!

Colin :smile:

P.S. Well, Forktail did invite "humorous asides".

[forktail]

Great programme (I might go and dig it out and watch it again), both serious and light-hearted, and made us all realise what a load of prats we are!

Colin :smile:

P.S. Well, Forktail did invite "humorous asides".

Cheers Colin

remember it well, a couple of my old birder mates actually made the doc. I even got a some work helping with the filming! Good times.

Incidentally, the flycatcher was reported as calling yesterday - a thin high-pitched single note.

F.

[snowfinch]

I happened to have the chance to watch the Waxham flycatcher on Tuesday morning with a dead Pied Flycatcher in my hand for comparison.
Yes the dead Pied Flycatcher had a pale buff median wing covert bar on each wing, but not as obvious as the Waxham PF.
However the tail patterns were obviously different, the white on the dead PF extended down the outer web of the outer tail feather to the tip becoming very narrow(less than 1mm) at the tip. Looking at the undertail of the dead PF this bird showed no white on the underside of the tail.On the Waxham PF the tail showed white to the tip(difficult to assess but judged to be more than 1mm) but the white on the underside of the outer tail feather was clearly visible on both the outer and inner webs of the feather.
This is supposedly not a feature of Pied.
Also in Sinclair's Birds South of the Sahara it says the white outer tails feather on Semi-collard is diagnostic.
Thus whatever the Waxham PF is, it is not a PF if Sinclair's book is correct.

[forktail]

White as base of primaries extends out onto p6 only.

Lots of reasons why it isn't one, but can anybody tell me why they think this is a Semi-collared?

Brian S

Hi Brian

in one of Dave's pix it can be seen to start on P5 but only just. (Dave worked with Mild on Collared's just to give a little background to the whole thing.)

The fact that Mild (in BW 7) stated the three Euro Ficedulas in first-winter to be pretty much unidentifiable in the field at least makes it worth discussing even if the bird is 'just' a Pied. And I would agree that the Semi-c call is more Collared-like than Pied - I remember likening it a bit to a Thrush Nightingale when I used to hear them on my local patch in Greece (thin and indrawn if I recall correctly, which i might not as it was ten years ago now :puzzled:.).

[Ilya Maclean]

Also in Sinclair's Birds South of the Sahara it says the white outer tails feather on Semi-collard is diagnostic.
Thus whatever the Waxham PF is, it is not a PF if Sinclair's book is correct.

I suspect Sinclair's book refers to adults. 1st winter pied fly's often have white outer tail feathers (see attached photo of a definate Pied Fly + Mild BW article)

[Brian S]

Two questions.

Can we use the tail pattern differences described for adults on first-winters?

Does anybody have or know of a Semi-collared Flycatcher photograph in first-winter plumage?

Brian S

[JHvS]

And I would agree that the Semi-c call is more Collared-like than Pied - I remember likening it a bit to a Thrush Nightingale when I used to hear them on my local patch in Greece (thin and indrawn if I recall correctly, which i might not as it was ten years ago now :puzzled:.).
Hmmm, that's sort of how I described the Collared's call on the BF thread. Too bad the bird wasn't trapped – I think in these cases catching would improve our ID skills (OK, of some of us anyway!)
Although the plumage features seem to point rigorously to Pied, that call really bugs me!

[Brian S]

For some autumn pics of Semi-collared try http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=listpictures&species_id=712

Brian S

[JHvS]

http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=showpicture&picture_id=13461 shows a very narrow and short wing spot... Only the eye ring looks brighter compared to http://birdforum.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=160278&d=1221593062. Surely if that would turn up, we'd laugh it away? Pied should migrate through Turkey at that time.

[Brian S]

To all those on birdforum, here's a pic of a wing-barred pied fly

Brian S

[JanJ]

Not disputing the SCF theory, but I wonder if we have some whishfull thinking here. There´s really nothing in my opinion that would exclude a 1st winter (tertial pattern) Pied. The all pale edged outer t-feather is nothing new for 1st winter Pied as are not a second wingbar (median coverts)

September 1st winter Pied:

http://www.sofnet.org/file/SVFLUG1.JPG?Path=2&ID=2538&File=SVFLUG1.JPG

another 1st winter:

http://www.sofnet.org/file/SVFLU2.JPG?Path=2&ID=2538&File=SVFLU2.JPG

Male 1st winter, note the black tail, blackish uppertail coverts and pale tipped median coverts, pattern on the outer t-feather is difficult to see properly:

http://www.birds.se/images/svflu_1K-hane02_030726_SH.jpg

Male Sept:

http://www.birds.se/images/svflu_1K04_030902_SH.jpg

Same individual as abve:

http://www.birds.se/images/svflu_1K03_030902_SH.jpg

Tail:

http://www.birds.se/images/svflu_1K_tail01_030902_SH.jpg

All images by Stefan Hage Sweden

The Waxham bird:

http://kellingnaturegallery.fotopic.net/c1579960.html

JanJ

[macrourus]

agree in all with Jan, could add that the only odd character seems to be the very grey-silvery looking of the neck, good for semi and collared too... but tertailc etc. would rule them out, though 1st y semi could show broader tertials edges
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