Mystery Wader?

[Red-eyed Video]

A still cropped from some recent video, just for fun, can you tell what it is yet?

[Gooseman]

Curlew sandpiper i think. The upper mandible of a wader's bill is flexible, as can be seen in this pic

[Colin Key]

Tempted to say (jokingly) that it is a cross between Curlew and Terek Sandpiper. I am not aware that the upper mandible of a wader's bill is flexible (as Gooseman seems to believe), and if this is a mutation (but how would the bird feed?) I would go for Terek Sand. Apart from suggesting a "Photoshop Job" I just dunno.

Colin :err:

[MichaelF]

Waders' bills are flexible; look up rhynchokinesis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhynchokinesis

It is most conspicuously visible when the bird is yawning (as I'd say this one is) or stretching.

[Brian S]

Dunlin for me, as I think the structure of Curlew Sand is more attenuated, with longer wings producing a longer primary extension than the very short one on this image.

Curlew Sand http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=showpicture&picture_id=18604

Dunlin http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=showpicture&picture_id=2021

Or am I completely misreading the image?

Brian S

[Red-eyed Video]

Another image with slightly less cropping just to add some confusion or give more clues.

[Colin Key]

This adds confusion, me thinks. So, Tereks and Sanderling are there, I really cannot see Dunlin as Brian suggests, and I would now introduce the possibility of Pec Sand (I had originally thought that a possibility on the basis of breast markings, but considered the bill too long).

Colin :puzzled:

[Colin Key]

Waders' bills are flexible; look up rhynchokinesis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhynchokinesis

It is most conspicuously visible when the bird is yawning (as I'd say this one is) or stretching.

I find this quite amazing Michael, especially since it states that the upper mandible is prone to this. I have handled a few recently-dead waders not long ago (a couple of b@stards had shot two bucket-fulls, about 50 birds, mostly Redshank, Knot and Dunlin, and I caught them plucking them on the beach) and I found the bills of these birds quite resilient. I would have thought that any flexibility would be in the lower mandible which in most species seems to be less tough than the upper.

I find it difficult to believe that "yawning" could produce the degree of deformation seen on Dave's photos.

Live and learn!

Colin

[MichaelF]

I think I'd tend to favour ad. winter Curlew Sandpiper too, though it isn't the best of pics (and I've only ever seen Curlew Sands in juv. and ad. summer plumages, not winter).

I have handled a few recently-dead waders ... the bills of these birds quite resilientRigor mortis. Happens soon after death.

I find it difficult to believe that "yawning" could produce the degree of deformation seen on Dave's photos
Take a look at the photos in the BB article cited by wikipedia (BB 95: 395-397, Aug. 2002)!

[Colin Key]

Terek ruled out on lack of typically steep forehead. Bill too long for Pec Sand. I still cannot see Dunlin here. Which leaves Curlew Sand.

I cannot find a photo of a winter plumaged CS, but here is an Autumn shot (Castro Marim, 6th September):

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/Passarinhos/0C0J2519b.jpg

I find it incredible that the upper mandible of this bird could deform to that extent!!

On Dave's ('orrible :smile:) photo the 'super' and head shape look good for CS, but I have not seen that degree of dark breast coloration. Looking at some adults and 1st winters this afternoon the breast is almost clean white.


Colin

[Red-eyed Video]

Curlew sandpiper i think.

Welcome to the forum and congratulations on your winning first post.

Apart from suggesting a "Photoshop Job" I just dunno.

Colin :err:

Would I? :yes:

Waders' bills are flexible; look up rhynchokinesis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhynchokinesis





Dunlin http://www.netfugl.dk/pictures.php?id=showpicture&picture_id=2021

Brian S

I have handled a few recently-dead waders not long ago (a couple of b@stards had shot two bucket-fulls, about 50 birds, mostly Redshank, Knot and Dunlin, and I caught them plucking them on the beach)

Live and learn!

Colin

Live and learn as you say. I now know this is called rhynchokinesis & Dunlin is Almindelig Ryle in Dutch, can anyone give an exact translation?

I know someone who had a cottage in Portugal and he described a bird being barbequed by a neighbour holding the plucked bird by its long pink legs.


I find it incredible that the upper mandible of this bird could deform to that extent!!

On Dave's ('orrible :smile:) photo .


Colin

So did I. I only noticed it as I was editing the video which was taken into the sun with a converter using digital zoom so no prizes for quality but interesting none-the-less it seems. Can't seem to add an attachment at the mo.


Thanks all for participating.

[forktail]

Sorry for posting after the event

The large extent of white fore-supercilium is perhaps the best pointer to Curlew Sand, although it's not that obvious in the pic. The bill length, while pointing heavily towards Curlew Sand might fit the longer end of (alpina) Dunlin and the upperparts colour looks more Dunlin-esque due to the 'dirty' light. Shows how tricky one pic can be - if we didn't all know it already!

[Colin Key]

Great thread Dave, a lovely diversion, and congrats to Gooseman.

I still find this idea of bill distortion to that extent difficult to believe, though.

Best,

Colin :wub::yes:

[Colin Key]

I know someone who had a cottage in Portugal and he described a bird being barbequed by a neighbour holding the plucked bird by its long pink legs.




Well known dish Dave: "Pernilongo grehlado" = Barbecued Black-winged Stilt.

Colin :realmad:

[Red-eyed Video]

I may get round to posting a slowed down video clip in a few day, in the meantime here's the bird seconds later.

[MichaelF]

I now know this is called rhynchokinesis

Greek, rhynchos, beak, and kinesis, movement

& Dunlin is Almindelig Ryle in Dutch, can anyone give an exact translation?
Danish, not Dutch! Almindelig = common, ryle = Calidris sandpiper [stints, etc], so basically 'Common Stint'. Also e.g. Krumnæbbet Ryle 'bent-billed stint' = Curlew Sandpiper; Dværgryle 'dwarf stint' = Little Stint; Temmincksryle (you can work that one out yourself!!); Islandsk Ryle 'Icelandic stint' = Knot; etc.

[forktail]

Greek, rhynchos, beak, and kinesis, movement


Danish, not Dutch! Almindelig = common, ryle = Calidris sandpiper [stints, etc], so basically 'Common Stint'. Also e.g. Krumnæbbet Ryle 'bent-billed stint' = Curlew Sandpiper; Dværgryle 'dwarf stint' = Little Stint; Temmincksryle (you can work that one out yourself!!); Islandsk Ryle 'Icelandic stint' = Knot; etc.

I feel like Alan Davis to your Stephen Fry, Michael

F.:wideeyed:

[Red-eyed Video]

Shows how tricky one pic can be - if we didn't all know it already!

True. It wasn't meant to trick anyone of course, just to show the extent of flexibility of the bill.

And what's with stopping the blog? :hmpf:How am I going to waste my time now that skills-bills has gone too? Unless it's some kind of Bowie-esque last gig pact. Thank God for punkbirder (http://www.freewebs.com/punkbirder/index.htm) that's all I can say. :beer:

[MichaelF]

I feel like Alan Davis to your Stephen Fry
You've lost me there . . Who are they??

[Red-eyed Video]

Greek, rhynchos, beak, and kinesis, movement


Danish, not Dutch! Almindelig = common, ryle = Calidris sandpiper [stints, etc], so basically 'Common Stint'. Also e.g. Krumnæbbet Ryle 'bent-billed stint' = Curlew Sandpiper; Dværgryle 'dwarf stint' = Little Stint; Temmincksryle (you can work that one out yourself!!); Islandsk Ryle 'Icelandic stint' = Knot; etc.


I'm impressed.


Of course, netfugl.dk, Denmark.

[Gooseman]

Glad to be of help. In regards to rhynchokinesis I have seen godwit and snipe both flex their upper mandibles to an extent you would not beleive if you hold the traditional view, as I did, that a bird's bill is a ridgid structure. Presumably as both of these species probe deeply in mud for their food a flexible bill is useful for catching slippery invertebrates. I seem to remember an article about it in I think British Birds a few years ago.



"Take a look at the photos in the BB article cited by wikipedia (BB 95: 395-397, Aug. 2002)!"

Sorry, I should read more slowly!!

[Gooseman]

PS. that picture of the three waders is great, love to come across them in south yorkshire. I'd settle for the sanderling actually!

[Brian S]

Okay, so Curlew Sand it is, but the tone of the bird in the pic is not really helpful (I'm searching for excuses here......)

Brian S

[Colin Key]

.... (I'm searching for excuses here......)

Brian S

Aren't we all !!! (I still find it difficult to believe).

Colin :ohdear::err::beer:

[Red-eyed Video]

Okay, so Curlew Sand it is, but the tone of the bird in the pic is not really helpful (I'm searching for excuses here......)

Brian S

No excuses needed Brian, it's a poor picture and one I.D. that would never be questioned in real life. This was a split second video still image of an unfamiliar action which surprised me and that's why I posted it.

It never amazes me that genuine 'what's this bird' pics could answer themselves if the photographer took the photo when the bird turned its head a little for instance. (Or in this case, closed its bill!)

As I said in the first post, just for fun so no embarrassment needed. :ohdear:

[Josh Jones]

I find it incredible that the upper mandible of this bird could deform to that extent!!

Flexibility! Dowitchers are also good at it, search surfbirds for photos of them doing it.

Bird in question to me is a Curlew Sand

http://avesphoto.com/website/pictures/SDPCUR-6.jpg

EDIT: woops didn't see the second attached pic confirming it as ferruginea

[DanielS]

http://shorebirds.exblog.jp/10097024/ More flexible upper mandibles.