February 26th, 2009, 09:36 AM
Streptopelia orientali or Streptopelia turturs?
Image taken in mid-February in Luxor.
February 26th, 2009, 05:48 PM
February 26th, 2009, 07:59 PM
Originally Posted by RoyHargreaves
I looked at Jacqeline's photo earlier today and could not come to a conclusion after delving into the literature (I have no experience of "oriental") - why are you so certain that this is turtur?
February 26th, 2009, 09:02 PM
it has a grey nape (rather than dark)
black and white (rather than grey and white) neck bars - fewer in number than on typical Oriental
the scap and covert fringes are very broad and bright
tail tip looks entirely white as opposed to grey (western orientalis "meena" can be whitish though)
the rump and mantle aren't grey-toned but rather brown etc
Last edited by forktail; February 26th, 2009 at 09:07 PM.
February 27th, 2009, 09:47 AM
Like Forktail I have the advantage of having seen orientalis (both nominate and meena). In addition to the points mentioned by him, which are all correct, the centres of the tertials, scapulars and wing-coverts are black, not dark grey, and they are pointed whereas orientalis and meena have blunt-tipped centres that more closely follow the feather edges, hence the narrower fringes of orientalis & meena. I have no doubt some people will say that body bulk is difficult to assess from photos, but even meena, which is smaller than orientalis is bulkier and built more like a Stock Dove than a Turtle Dove.
I have also heard tha there is a case for splitting meena from orientalis - now that will be fun.
February 27th, 2009, 05:15 PM
I just compared Jacqueline's image to those in "Collins" and thought I could see features of both species. A delve into web photos then further confused me.
February 28th, 2009, 10:03 AM
As we all know interpreting photos is not without its difficulties - most of us get caught out sometimes. Also while it is comforting to assume that books don't have mistakes and photos on the web are correctly identified this isn't always the case - believe me.
Recently in UK Fieldfares have moved into gardens in numbers not usually seen. As a consequence the number of photos our local yahoogroup has received has increased. One person claimed a Snowfinch, but wanted confirmation. We all immediately knew it to be a Fieldfare, but said person wasn't happy with that becuase "it was feeding like a finch". Presumably they meant taking berries off bushes - something we all know Fieldfares do. At least I hope we do!!